Chromatography Forum

Hello,
We are thinking of buying a couple of second hand GC systems and have come across quite a few Agilent 5890 Series II for sale. I've used a 6890 before and really liked it, is the 5890 as user friendly? Does anyone know when the 5890 Series II was introduced? We are hoping to use the GC for VFA analysis as we currently use HPLC and it's taking far too long (really yucky samples!). Unfortunately we don't have the money to buy a nice new system so would welcome any comments on the best second hand machine to go for.
Thanks,
Frosty

Hi Frosty

One of the reasons that there are so many 5890 Series IIs on the second hand market is that Agilent does not support them any more. They cannot run with the new software (and the old software does not run on current Windows versions), or the new autosamplers and you cannot get spares for any of the electronics. So if you buy one, the first time that it breaks will be the last time. we had to retire GCs that were in working order because the autosamplers malfunctioned.

When manufacturers deliberately obsolete their instrumentation like this it makes me think several times about buying any more of their hardware.

Peter

Both the HP5890 and Thermo Trace use very similar buttons, commands and are generally easy to use if you know the 6890. It is general policy for most manufacturers to drop support for kit 10 years after it was last sold. For most this just means they no longer make new parts so anything that breaks and is unique to that model will mean it can no longer be repaired with new parts. There are plenty of second hand GC resellers including us www.ceinstruments.co.uk and in our opinion it is the back up and support for the products once you have bought them that makes the difference. We only sell GCs we can support and are factory trained for Carlo Erba/Fisons/Thermo
If you are just interested in a cheap 5890 there is one on e-bay at the moment item no 7607306875
My guess is that the 5890 series II must have come out around 1990 and must have been replaced by the 6890 around 1996

We are currently using a pair of HP 5890A GC's, which I understand are very similar to the HP5890 series II. We manage to keep them in service with the help of a company called alpha omega technologies (www.alphaomegatech.com). They advertise themselves as experts in keeping these older "obsolete" HP/Agilent systems operational. You might contact them and inquire into parts and service availability before purchase.

I've never been in the same room as a 6890, so I can't compare the 5890 to a 6890.

We are currently running 8 HP5890's and 3 HP6890's. I am unfamiliar with other models as these are the only ones I have worked with. I would imagine every instrument will become obsolete at some point so if you are to purchase an older model at least get the one that has the most instruments left out there. I would not be surprised if it were the 5890. We have also used Alpha omega and replaced a number of towers recently with no problems. We use Chemstation software and although it is an older version than what we run the 6890's on, the older version should still run on everything right up to XP.

We have both 5890 II and 6890 here, all computerized. The 6890 models all have standard EPC and self-lighting FIDs; on 5890 II EPC was an option, and 5890 uses manual gas shut offs for the detectors. We run most of the 5890s on Win95/A.06 software, but one runs on A.09 with ChemStore. Shimadzu makes an autosampler that is a sure-fit for the 5890 (we have one, works fine, through the Agilent software) and Agilent has recently backwards adapted the newer autosamplers to fit the 5890s, look on their web-page. We got the Shimadzu to try out when the only other option was "used". Like another poster states, there are aftermarket companies who will still work on 5890s and their autosamplers. In other words, we're staying with our 5890s here.

Hey MrShorty, your not missing much by not being in the same room as a 6890. With the 5890 you get to manually light the flame, set pressure and flow, go through 15 windows to set up your method whereas with the 6890 it lights the flame for you, you click on your column and it sets everything, just about everything in method is accessed in one window, no fun whatsoever. Plus, with the new pulsed injection thingy, its not nearly such a challenge getting down to those ppb levels.
In all seriousness, our 5890 series II GC’s are workhorses that perform very well. Once again though, I have never worked with other models and am not the person to be making comparisons.

Hi,

Second hand GCs are like second hand cars, projected life depends on the previous owner. You can tell the manufacturing date, and go for the cleanest and youngest you can afford of the desired configuration.

I've worked with 5890s since they first came out, and if they are well maintained they will last decades. The main failure I've encountered is the oven motor bearings and the glow plug ignition for FID - both cheap to fix. If they have been in a lab with good electricity supply and good clean dry gas supplies, that will minimise future issues.

My previous employer has two 5890As and a 5890A Series II still going strong - just retired a 5792A ( the 5890a predecessor and one of the best GCs ever... ) after about 20 years continuous use, all with autosamplers.

I haven't had much experience with the later versions with electronic features, so can't comment, but would caution about buying old GCs if you want to hook them up to modern data systems. It's almost better to buy the whole deal of the era ( eg 5890a Series II, Chemstation on windows NT or whatever ).

Note that many of the 5890II originally worked with hardwired integrators ( eg 3395s ), but Windows PC Chemstation systems would be preferable, ideally with HPIB rather than HPIL, and a later release of Chemstation ( after A v8.xx ). Check around, as some companies will shift them because Agilent suggort has ceased, and many will hardly be worn in. Autosamplers are nice, and should also be preferred.

The issue of spares shouldn't be too traumatic ( given the 100,000 or so lurking on the planet ), but if these GCs are critical to your business, then push you boss to buy new, even if only one now and the other later. Buying second hand GCs for critical applications is likely to invoke Murphy's law.

I hope this is helpful,

Bruce Hamilton

Hi all

re. 5890GC's

They can be great and easy to use if you keep them doing the same applications and don't have to change things such as split flow etc but it can be more of a challenge to use them for situations where different people are using different conditions on a regular basis.

I read from Agilent's web site that the 5890's are being supported until the end of Oct 06 so you might be able to get them to come out in the meantime

Also, we have been able to get our 5890 series II (and autosampler) to work with Windows XP service pack 2 (Chemstation A.10.01) without any problems. I am even planning to try it with the 32-bit Chemstation B versions that are now available (when I feel brave!!)

Kevin

Hello,
Thanks everyone for your comments, they are really helpful!
Best Wishes,
Frosty

The electronics do go bad with time, I had to replace our TCD board ($600), and the detector heater element suddenly stopped being recognized by the control panel (fixed this by yanking it out and stuffing the other heated zone element in, which fortunately wasn't in use).

I've had good experiences with Compco Analytical, in NJ. The old Chemstation software is good for controlling the GC, but its data analysis is pretty awful. You can convert files to ASCII format and use any other peak analysis program, and could possibly do both acquisition and analysis using a program like EZChrom.

We also have a 6890 with a MS and different detector - it seems to have a lot more features, but nothing special. The main advantage is electronic control of gas flow rates! (you sit there with a bubble flowmeter adjusting knobs on the 5890). GC's are relatively simple collections of valves, tubing, inlets, column, and detector - so really all you're getting with the 6890 is increased remote control, possibly some better resolution with whatever software package it comes with.

Hello,

We have a great autosampler product especially tailored for the 5890. The Cobra is a 100% drop-in upgrade for the 7673 and provides full instrument control under your choice of Chrom software. We support all versions of ChemStation, etc that support the 5890/7673. The Cobra migrates to the 6890 as well. This ALS is a true xyz robotic sample prep platform, full featured and has full instrument control with the Diplomat (TM) technology. Please visit our web site at www.horizon2.com and click "Watch Cobra L/S run here" to see the one minute video.

David