Excel Based Chromatography Software

[adam]

Hello All

In our lab we used to use Excel to process our data. Then, about a year ago we installed and started using the new software made by one of the big HPLC companies (which I'm intentionally not mentioning).

We find that this software is very difficult for people to use and - even after a year - it really doen't seem to be saving us much time. If all our methods were the same it might be a different story, but when you have a variety of circumstances it is more complicated (e.g. some methods use multiple wavelengths and some just use one...some methods use a single point calibration and some use multipoint...and there are several different ways that we report impurity values). At my previous company we had similar problems with a different vendor's chromatography software. So I'm starting to think none of them are really user friendly.

The strange thing is that, when we used Excel we didn't have these problems. Every chemist in the lab knew exactly how to process their data. Of course, the trade off is that with Excel it is labor intensive to set up individual equations, and paste in the area count values (and even from a GMP compliance standpoint, Excel is not the best).

So here is my question. It seems the best option would be an excel based system, but one that is validated and one where calculations can be done in a more automated fashion. Does anyone know if such a system exists in the world.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated. There must be a powerful and user friendly software out there somewhere. I've been doing this type of work for almost 20 years and I haven't seen it yet.

[ACrawshaw]

Hi Adam,

From what you are describing, I am assuming that you are currently not using Chromeleon (Fingers Crossed!).

Have a look at the link below. I think this is exactly what you are looking for:

http://www.dionex.com/en-us/products/ch ... 73027.html

Amongst many other features, Chromeleon contains an Excel based reporting interface. This allows for complete customisation of your reports and actually includes approximately 130 Excel based logic functions (Average, Stdev, Address, Lookup, etc).

Essentially this runs exactly as Excel, however the big advantage is that it obviously negates any possible transcription error from software to spreadsheet as the data is self contained.

If you would like any more information or even a demonstration, I am sure your local sales representive would be more than happy to help.

Thanks

[aceto_81]

I'm not aware of such functionality in Excel, except from when you do all your calculations manually, or at least type them in once in Excel.
One thing you can automate is to export your results from within you CDS (whichever it is), and read this file from your Excel through a VBA macro.

And then comes the validation part of your Excel....

If you are working under GMP compliant circumstances, I hope you can get away with this one.

So maybe it is better to use a CDS where all your requirements are possible, even if it is painfull to implement at first (I think you get a long term benefit).

And the things you name as examples (multiple WL, single point and multiple point calibration), all possible with the CDS we use here.

Ace

[lmh]

My (limited) experience is that almost all labs who struggle with their chromatography software need training rather than new software.

The problem is that once staff have decided that CurrentChrom is useless, it's almost impossible to get them to change their minds. It's almost as though they begin to pride themselves on finding bugs in CurrentChrom, rather than working out how to use it. Sometimes I think it is more efficient to buy NewChrom in order to get rid of old prejudices and start fresh with new training!

[CE Instruments]

Sounds to me that your data system has not been set up properly for you. It is possible with most data systems to set up any required protocols for data processing and to then select them as part of the method within the sample table. This should be as quick and easy as using a excel form. Perhaps you could get an expert on your software to provide training in how to set up your software and train one of the operators to be the expert for developing new methods. Export to Excel is also usually supported but will not be part of the compliant part of the software.

[adam]

Interesting.

So any Chromelean users out there that want to comment. Have your experiences been good, bad, or otherwise.

Thanks

[ACrawshaw]

Hi Adam,

Hopefully you'll get some positive feedback from your question, but just to clarify some of the points above.

Firstly, if you are looking to implement the software into a reglulated environment, Chromeleon is CFR Part 11 ready and so can be deployed in a compliant fashion in accordance with your SOP's.

Specfically with regards to the reporting functionality, any calculations that are performed simply by using the Chromeleon Variables i.e. Area's, Height's, Weight's, etc can be considered validated and no further work should be required. Although many people when using the software to perform calculations for the first time may perform some simple verifications against the previous method of calculation for piece of mind.

If you start to use the 'Excel' Logic and perform 'Custom Calculations' outside of the report tables, then you will need to consider some form of validation. This would be much like validating a spreadsheet. As such, the software will actually display all formula's within each cell of a particular sheet.

Just to re-affirm, there is no requirement to export the data out of the software and into Excel as all the calculations can be done within the Chromeleon.

Thanks

[Johnny Rod]

I would echo the comments above about using the CDS you have; they are big complicated things and do take some time to get the hang of. However getting it configured right, including reporting, makes a big difference, and having an in-house expert also helps a great deal. I'd be interested to see Chromelon though, it's one I haven't had my hands on.

[ACrawshaw]

Johnny,

Next time I'm in the area, I'd be happy to pop in and let you have a look?

Thanks

[varossf]

Yep and OpenLAB CDS EZChrom has its advanced reporting tool which resembles Excel and pulls in the results directly from your runs.

[paulw]

A part 11 compliant CDS will save you major headache and tears and potentially a nice fat 483. If you use Excel spreadsheets you have to validate them. Then you have to lock down any cell that does calculations. Then you still have to transcribe the numbers each time you use it. Then you have the issue of anyone can do a %RSD on a blank spreadsheet so they know before they generate the "official" spreadsheet how the results look, which I'm sure all the analysts around you are as pure as freshly fallen snow, but temptation can come to all in time.

As for which CDS:

If I had to pick one that I got to use, I'd pick Empower (with Chromeleon really really close behind).
If I had to pick one that I had to teach other people to use, I'd pick Chromeleon.

[Johnny Rod]

Anthony this is a long-term plan, we don't have the budget just yet, would really want a trial version/machine really.

[adam]

Hey Paul W

So I can't resist asking. If Chromelean is easier to use, what would cause you to give a slight edge to Empower.

Especially since you seemed to indicate it was only a very slight edge, and usability is such an important thing.

Thanks

[adam]

And while I'm at it, let me ask one more question.

Is Chromelean still easy to use in situations where you have different wavelengths being used for different analytes.

Or in terms of being able to express impurities in different units (area % vs %LC etc)

Thanks again

[ACrawshaw]

Adam: As a completely non-bias, non-partisan, impartial, simple answer to your last questions.....Yes

Johnny: If you get to that point, just get in touch. We often do on-site evaluations of software and hardware and so this wouldn't be a problem. This includes running software on 3rd party hardware if that is what you need. In this instance I was more than happy to just give you a tour of the software to wet your appetite!