Chromatography Forum

We're currently purchasing a new GC-MS. This is our first, and to be frank, I don't have that much experience on MS systems.

We've got two competing offers we're now considering, and I'd like to have any opinions on behalf or against either one of them. The products are:

Agilent 7890A GC with 5975C VL MSD/DS Diffusion pump Bundle

and

Shimadzu GCMS-QP2010S with a rotary pump E2M 1.5 SET

The price is about the same, on the exception that our offer from agilent comes with NIST libraries 2008 and shimadzu has NIST 2005. And of course, the shimadzu has 150 vial sampler whereas the corresponding sampler on agilent is only 100 vial. I know that the pumps are about the same, as neither of them is a turbo pump.

Any user experience is appreciated.

Having worked with Agilents for over 10 years, I recently bucked the trend and bought a QP2010S from Shimadzu with Markes TD unit and 150 place autosampler.

Very happy with it so far. Software is easy to use and maintenance is a doddle compared to the Agilent. Support seems to be better too, and its easier to reach an engineer/technical support than it is at Agilent.

Just my opinion

We have been happy with our Shimadzu QP2010. It has great sensitivity and has been very reliable. I don't have much experience with agilent, but I believe you even have to pay for telephone tech support? Definitely not the case with Shimadzu. Their tech support is excellent (and free), and our service engineer will even come out at no charge for travel.

Hello!

Agilent is the reference on GC analysis
It is simply, good support, high sensitivity, easy to work, a big oven door, Ion source is easy to dismount, low maintenance needed..ect. ...and some company sale Agilent consumables or equivalent.....
You can heat the quad, so, it is more stable and no need to clean.
The TAD detector is very sensitive. I love the msdchemstation...easy to use, friendly user.

I use Agilent MSD for pesticide multiresiudes analysis (300 pesticides in two injections) since year 1998 and I have no problem....a low LOD, repeatability et reproductibiltity with low maintenance needed....i clean my ion source only one by year.....and my next msd instrument will be Agilent

Heikki,

I would go for the Agilent system blindfolded. They are quite robust and easy to maintain.
Regarding the service there seem to be some regional differences (reading the previous posts…).
In Belgium they are great in your country I don’t know. Normally, you can ask both suppliers few names of their customers that can help you out.

Best regards
bhuvfe

I think you should inform yourself about the quality of technical support in your country. Probably there won't be big differences in the instruments, but in the technical support.

In my case, I am working for nearly 10 years with Agilent, excellent instruments, but mainly because of the excellent support. I'd never by a Thermo instrument, not because the instrument is bad or worse, but Thermo lacks technical support in my country, worse impossible.

Heikki, the Shimadzu system does have a turbo pump, all Shimadzu GCMS systems have a turbo.

I ve used Agilent MSD quite a long time, in general, it's no problem, and robust.

I have one Shimadzu autosampler tower, and it failed to communicate with my ChemStation software after a few years. I made a call, and sent a few E-mails to Shimadzu, who initially suggested some things to try. But those didn't work, and Shimadzu reps stopped returning my communications. So that episode (for me) is steering me away from considering Shimadzu in the future. Remember, it's my one experience.

So as a summary, both manufacturers make great equipment, each with their own flaws. It's the question about the tech support that handles the specific flaws.

I think I'm inclining towards the agilent, as we currently do have couple of Agilent's 6890N GC's. My initial reaction was to pick the Agilent one, as I have experience from their other equioments and software.

Now it's just the matter of convincing our CEO the 2,5% more expensive Agilent is the way to go... experience in boss handling appreciated

Heikki.

Based on your comment, I would argue that because you already have 6890's and you are familiar with their operations and maintenance there will be less training and fewer parts to maintain if you stay with Agilent GC.

Never worked with Shimadzu so I cannot offer advice there.

Best regards.

Hi everybody.

I have been working with Agilent GC/MS since 1994 and my experience has been great both with the instruments and with the technical service. My lab has also Shimadzu instruments (LC mainly) and the consensus seems to be that they are OK. However, Shimadzu's technical service in my country leaves everything to be desired: low cualification, long response times...
( I must clarify that Shimadzu itself does not sell or provide support directly in my country, that is done by a local lab supplies company).

I'm going to have to go with the majority on this one. We use Agilent and Varian systems here. The Agilent systems have the feeling that if they were dropped off the bench they would probably still work (don't try this at home). The Varian systems just don't feel as robust and they need a lot more tlc.

I have never used the Shimadzu systems but the Agilent systems are robust and you have used them before so go with what you know unless you desperately need some of the innovations that Shimadzu can provide.

If you can have a look at the software you will be using. MS chemstation makes a huge difference to how usable a system is.

Rich

It may be worth asking the sales rep for each instrument for a list of local references of folks who have had instruments for over a year, even if not the model you are looking at. A few discussions may help clarify service and support in your area.

If your other instruments are Agilent, I would buy the agilent gc/ms. That way, all the parts you buy are uniform and you only have to train employees on one type of instrument and software.

You don't necessarily have to buy the newest model Agilent either to be honest. The Agilent system you're looking at is about $60,000 U.S. new? You can probably get a 6890/5973 for half that or around $25,000. Or a 5980/5972 for $15,000 but replacement quads are hard to find for these anymore.

If you're a first time buyer, find the price that meets your requirements. And I doubt you really need to spend what I think you're about to.