Chromatography Forum

We are a small lab with two GC/MS's, one ICP, one Hg analyzer, and various other pieces of support equipment (pH meters, balances, microwave, etc.). Reporting data manually on an excel spreadsheet is a time consuming effort; not to mention QA reviews and transcription error reviews. Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated. I've done a bit of an on-line search; but I'm unsure of what features I should be looking for/what features are just fluff/what sets one program apart from others. Advise on specific questions I should be asking of different vendor would also be welcomed.

We are a small lab

At an ALMA (labmanagers.org) training conference some years ago, we were told that a LIMS would be million dolalrs minimum, over a year to implement. We haven't one.

Duplication, see below

Hi,
With Excel macroprogramming and Word templates you can streamline the workflow well. Maybe combined with an simple database made with Filemaker or Access. This may be good as many LIMS systems for a small lab. There a terrible many ways to fail with a LIMS.

For a small lab, a cost-effective alterantive may be to rent a LIMS, offered by many vendors. Several LIMS vendors are found at www.scientific-computing.com

This is a short list of some LIMS vendors with modern LIMS:

www address Product Name
www.autoscribe.co.uk Matrix Gemini LIMS
www.labvantage.com Sapphire
www.labware.com LIMS
www.Thermo.com Nautilus
www.blazesystems.com BlazeLIMS
www.starlims.com StarLIMS
www.perkinelmer.com LabWorks ES
www.qsius.com WinLIMS

GOOD LUCK!

Dear chromatographers:
We are exploring a low-cost LIMS also. With our paper-based system, one batch record may be 2-3 inches thick. Searching thru old batch records takes time.
Personally, I am evaluating a software called eLAB (free download at http://www.ebiosys.com/Applications/eLab/elab_setup.exe).
The cost for the enterprise version is just under $7K. (Very low indeed).
Disclaimer: I don't work for eBiosystem.

Thank you for your responses. I've realized the expense and difficulties I could potentially get us into without knowing as much as possible regarding LIMS. The alternatives of renting or taking advantage of the full capacitities of excel and access are great leads. I'm pretty good a excel but I sure there are functions I'm not aware of. An advanced class may help solve some dilemmas. Access on the other hand, is not as fluent for me. I've have to develop some skills for that part; a beginners class may be a prerequisite.

Keep them coming...I appreciate the advice, recommendations, and thoughts . I'd like to move forward with my eyes as focused as possible.

Depending on the software system you are using it may already have the capability to transfer the data. I have used both Empower and Chemstation software and they are capable of transferring data into excel relatively easily.

Also formatting excel data templates with locked calculations will reduce the QA review to only raw data. You can then just copy and paste data already formatted in excel into the templates, which greatly reduces transcription errors.

The basic instruments such as pH meters and balances although some are capable of sending the raw data to a computer the cost is generally not worth it and just having a printer is sufficient.

Hi All,

Transferring data to Excel should not be required .... and locking cells means very little. The spreadsheet will still need to be validated, which is a ver time consuming job for not much reward !!.
The software (in this case Empower and Chemstation) should be able to process ,calculate and report data ( once signed - ERES) in a suitable format for a simple transfer to final report.

We use LabWare which is very good but expensive so is probably better for larger labs with a nice healthy budget like us

A friend of mine in a small lab (and a lot less money!!) has just starting using LabHQ LIMS www.labhq.co.uk that sounds like it may work for you.

We also have LabWare, and it has been a pain from the start (about 18 months, now). From the slow interface to random crashes, I am sure it is not totally LabWare's fault, yet there does not seem to be any light at the end of the tunnel for improvements. We also still have HPLims online, which is much more stable, but less versatile.

For some interesting reading and background on the LIMS quagmire check out the article by Randy C. Hice in Scientific Computing.

http://www.scientificcomputing.com/Sear ... y+hice&f=0

There also open source versions on the web, if you google a bit, you will find them.
At the moment we are implementing a giant db based on postgresql (also open source), step by step, which may take us some years, but at a low cost.

Ace

If you are in anyway regulated I would not touch an open source LIMS. You will probably spend more on validating the system than you would buying another, and how could you audit them to ensure that the sofware has been built to any suitable standards (design specification, programing standards, unit code testing etc etc).

Look at the sites for LabWare, StarLims, LabHQ, Thermo, labvantage, SQLlims there is so much focus on quality and validation. You are dealing with data that can affect people lives if corrupted in any way, don't take the risk!

Just a note to help keep some people from confusing managers & vendors...

Going paperless=ELN (Electronic Lab Notebook)

- not the same thing as -

LIMS=Lab Information Management System, typically tasked with providing a database home for reviewed results.

In a well executed implementation in a lab where procedures are well designed and followed, ELN and LIMS are seamlessly integrated. Analytical people get data into the system via well automated means, the data gets electronically signed off after supervisory review, and is then available to end users via read access to the database (usually via well designed custom report templates).